The answer is always love




Ark:
“It’s not about ”taking my side”. The evidence against any sort of veracity concerning the character Jesus of Nazareth demonstrates unequivocally that you are wrong, so don’t put your dithering over God Soft Hands Jesus on me, thank you very much for nothing. You look for love? Great! Then why use a vile fictional character as a vehicle to promote it?”

Paulfg:
““Vile” is not evidence. “Vile” is subjective. That might be seen (by the lurkers) as taking sides.”

Ark:
“vile
vʌɪl/Submeter
adjective
extremely unpleasant.
“he has a vile temper”
synonyms: foul, nasty, unpleasant, bad, disagreeable, horrid, horrible, dreadful, abominable, atrocious, offensive, obnoxious, odious, unsavoury, repulsive, off-putting, repellent, revolting, repugnant, disgusting, distasteful, loathsome, hateful, nauseating, sickening; More
morally bad; wicked.
“as vile a rogue as ever lived”
archaic
of little worth or value.
“all the feasts that thou hast shared erewhile, to mine shall be but vile”

Which just about sums up the biblical god to a T don’t you think?”



Ark –

I have spent hours reading your words in my blog posts. You write much that is of value. And you write much that is not.

But today I learned something.

Not “this” (this I just accept) … You mix fact and fiction and call it fact. You insist others converse to your agenda. You insist on yes or no answers to allow the “conversation” to be dictated by you. You control and manipulate. And you use bad language to either shock and/or diminish the other person. All of that could be classed simply as “style”: “Good old Ark, there he goes again.” And I have.

But today I learned something for the first time.

You confirmed for me today that you are as much the same “poison” of which you accuse religion. You poison to perform.  You perform to poison.  You accuse. You seek no learning. You seek to lure vulnerable “brainwashed Christians” to (your) manipulative “intentional brainwashing”.

I have seen someone on your own blog “apologise” to you for simply typing an opinion you said was unacceptable.

You “proselytise” to lure others (three so far, according to you). Yet you detest those who talk about this “vile and fictitious Jesus of Nazareth” who are not even “proselytising”.

That is not “style”. That is your intentional choice. That is deceit.  That is poison.  That is so far from kindness that I choose to bar you from any further interaction on this blog.

You can suck the air out of a vacuum – I accept that. You are a charlatan – I can accept that.  Whether you are “right” or not is irrelevant – I can accept that as well.  But you always seek to demolish – you always demand complete submission – you always have to win (whether in measured or aggressive language).

And I learned today that you perform only to destroy others who disagree with you.  By your own words.  Which is evidence.  And beyond all reasonable doubt.

Paul

.

And to answer your expected objection about “love” and how is it loving to ban you …

This is a loving thing I do for myself and others I care for.  Some I care for can suck the air out of a vacuum – I accept that. Some are charlatans – I can accept that.  Whether they  are “right” or not is irrelevant – I can accept that as well.  But those I care for seek to build – they seek love.

And they are the very people you seek to destroy, to lure away and to brainwash … that I do name as “poisonous”.

Even if you won’t.

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13 thoughts on “The answer is always love

  1. Paulfg, you write, “You confirmed for me today that you are as much the same “poison” of which you accuse religion. You poison to perform. You perform to poison. You accuse. You seek no learning. You seek to lure vulnerable “brainwashed Christians” to (your) manipulative “intentional brainwashing”.”

    No.

    A person is not the same as a method.

    Disagree all you want with Ark but he brings a gun to a gun fight and can back up his ‘poison’ with a very great deal of knowledge independent of him.

    This matters.

    This knowledge – and not Ark’s character – is what makes his ‘poison’ toxic to those who wishfully and longingly try to portray Jesus – the man (fictional or non fictional who brought us this idea of eternal torment for those unwilling to accept his religious precepts – as loving. He’s not… and scripture – the Gospels specifically and the OT (not one jot or tittle of the Law is incorrect we are told by this character) generally (because the three are one, donchaknow) – describes in no uncertain terms why he’s not loving in his religious justifications for the treatment of others.

    Ark can explain all this in exquisite detail if you wish. But for you to continue to try to paint with a ridiculously wide brush Jesus as loving is factually wrong; his version of his religious belief is without a doubt physically threatening, morally confused, and emotionally a kind of blackmail used only by the most manipulative and conniving among us carried out and imposed on those we profess to ‘love’.

    By no stretch of the wishful imagination can anyone call this kind of treatment ‘love’… even by someone we believe is divine as well as a messiah. This is cargo cult thinking at its most obvious… ignoring and rejecting compelling evidence because it is contrary to what we wish to believe.

    That is what you’ve done and Ark is calling you on it. .

    Ark’s ‘performance’ is to stay true to a principle of calling a spade a spade no matter how offensive some may assume that to be. And for that, his character is enhanced and not diminished. We can all learn from him even if we neither like the message he delivers with passion nor the tone in which it is sometimes caustically delivered.

    • Tildeb, thank you for showing up in support of Ark. You do it well. And a personal note of thanks for the mindset shift of the hosting weekend. It had great value. But I cannot and will not separate the “process” from the “person”. That is how abuse happens – has happened – does happen.

      Ark’s performance is no less a sales pitch of certainty than that of which he accuses the church. And the damage he can cause is equally vicious. That is why I can never divide the process and person.

      And I can not call what Ark does, and the way in which he does it, anything less than destructive. And that – again – is something of which he accuses religion as a “bad thing”. Dear Tildeb – two “bad things” do not make a right thing. Two bad things really chew up the self-esteem and sanity of real people. Something else of which religion is accused. And yes it can and yes it does. But none of that absolves Ark of bringing the same “gun” to a gunfight I do not see.

      So please let’s call a spade a spade.

  2. Hey Paul. Heather here. I know it has been a long time since I have offered feedback but a Scripture came to mind as I read through Ark’s comments from the past few posts:

    “But even if you should suffer for the sake of righteousness, you are blessed. And do not fear their intimidation, and do not be troubled, but sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence; and keep a good conscience so that in the thing in which you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ will be put to shame. For it is better, if God should will it so, that you suffer for doing what is right rather than for doing what is wrong.” 1 Peter 3:14-17

    Ark is attempting to intimidate you. Don’t be troubled. Give it (and him) no more thought, Paul. You gave your account. You made your defense. It’s not your job to “convince” him of God.

    “For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.” Romans 1:18-20

    Ark is without excuse. He is suppressing the truth in unrighteousness. All you can do, Paul, is be the love of God and defend your faith when accusers confront you with their tactics that are grounded in ungodliness. Ark will be put to shame for reviling your good behavior. This persecution you have faced from him just means you are doing something right for God.

    Those are just my thoughts this afternoon. Thank you for the reminder that love is the answer.

    Blessings to you, my dirt brother.
    Heather

    • Hiya Heather – how gorgeous of you to stop by. The edit button is fun – so just one comment now. I am off to devour your words – see yiu soon..
      ((hugs))

    • And back again 🙂

      Firstly – thank you. But if this is persecution – I have been reading the wrong lines.

      Secondly – Ark has changed me. The “deal” is not that he also changes. But being changed has brought GSHJ into yet sharper relief. Bigger. More than. And Ark is part of that. So rather than feel persecuted I feel grateful.

      Finally – your being here would (perhaps) not have happened. And that is the greatest gift of all. How long is since we “spoke”? Yet however long is but the blink of an eye. How would I have experienced this if not for Ark?

      You are truly my dirt sister for all eternity.

      And that is … everything.

      Paul
      ((hugs))

    • Wow… so quick to judgement… in your humbleness, it goes without saying.

      Why do you link ‘righteousness’ to truth in its pious sense and yet deny any merit to those of us who actually and honestly inquire into your religious claims and finding them not just wanting of any truth merit but in fact contrary to respecting what IS true!

      According to your own reasoning, you are the one being ‘unrighteous’ here. Yet I don’t think that makes you as a person unrighteous; it simply exposes your thinking to be unconcerned with what is true and what is knowable. In your mind, this unconcern is what is righteous, which makes criticism unrighteous. That is the charge you lay against Ark. And it is not just.

      Your beliefs have consequences not just for you but, when you extend your misguided beliefs unconcerned with what is true and knowable into the world under the dishonest banner of ‘righteousness’, your beliefs become a force for perniciousness, for supporting related ideas similarly justified and stamped with pious ‘righteousness’ that do real harm to real people in real life impervious in the name of ‘righteousness’ to legitimate criticism. You know, the kind Ark offers free of charge, free of tuition, free of imposition. This way of protecting your piety is a methodological recipe for doing what you accuse Ark of doing… and now that you are aware of this criticism, YOU have no excuse to pull this crap on anyone else.

      • Tildeb, you told me earlier that I must separate the method from the person. That Ark’s esteem is enhanced when he diminishes another human being. His “style” and poison are to be applauded.

        Yet here you accuse Heather of doing the same methodology she accuses Ark of doing. A bad thing. Yet I make your same criticism of Ark, and you say Ark is right and I am not. Once again I find myself pondering the endorsement of personal vilification and abuse in the name of truth.

        I have no agenda other than kindness. With that agenda, one might observe a certain bias in your truth. And, by your own standards, that would be unfair. As might the consequences of that bias.

        (which – again – has similarities with “the religion” you consider so tainted)

        • “That Ark’s esteem is enhanced when he diminishes another human being.”
          That’s not what he’s doing and it’s not what I’m applauding. He is criticizing belief in certain incorrect ideas. You are the one – like Heather – who associates the incorrect idea as if it were a personal trait. It’s not. It’s a Bad Idea worthy of criticism… criticism that uses critical words.

          Imagine that. How very terrible. Not kind at all.

          Since when was kindness for Bad Ideas more important than respecting what’s true? Without the latter, I don’t think you can have an honest expression of the former.

  3. Pingback: And kindness is always right | Just me being curious

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